Introduction:

The micro-mobility revolution is transforming how we move around our cities, and Pacific Rides is at the forefront of this change. As an innovative motorized bike company, they have been making waves in the industry with their cutting-edge technology and commitment to sustainable urban transportation.

I recently had the opportunity to sit down with Ulysses Washington, the Chief Technical Officer of Pacific Rides, for an exclusive interview about his role in the company and the exciting future of micro-mobility. With a wealth of experience and insights, Washington sheds light on the company’s inner workings, the challenges and rewards of working in the micro-mobility space, and the role of technology in shaping the industry.

In this blog post, I’m excited to share my conversation with Ulysses Washington, delving into the world of Pacific Rides and exploring the innovative vision that drives their success.

Interview

Green Gorilla:

What’s going on bro Ulysses? Let’s just dive in. Tell me a little bit about your background and how you got into the motorized bike industry.

Ulysses Washington:

Well, it’s kind of a strange labyrinth of events that led me to where I am now. In short, my background is actually in music. I ran an independent distribution company back in the late 90s and early 2000s. I had an online music store where we sold independent vinyl, CDs, DVDs, and all that stuff. At the time, this was around 1999-2001, I was one of maybe five or six other websites across the internet in the US that catered to that niche. That was my first foray into global business. Eventually, I started doing distribution, then got into manufacturing. As you know, everything went digital with the onset of the iPod and similar technologies.

So when everything shifted to digital, my production partner and I decided to pivot and transition our label to a digital-based platform. After that, I got married and had a child. As I told you before, my wife was diagnosed with cancer.

Green Gorilla:

Oh, I didn’t know.

Ulysses Washington:

I’m sorry, I didn’t know if you were aware. But yes, this was back in 2012. Three months after she gave birth, she was diagnosed with stage three, bordering on stage four cancer—Hodgkin’s lymphoma. So, the music and everything stopped for me at that point. After her passing, I returned to California, and honestly, I had to reinvent myself. I wanted to pursue things I had always been interested in, to help me through the grieving process.

I got into racing, like go-karts, which I used to do as a kid. I started racing professionally and met a gentleman named Danny Perry, who became my mentor. He owned a shop called Pacific Rides. We struck a deal, and I started working for him as the general manager. I ran the shop, held the keys, and even started a racing organization out of the building. I’ll have to send you videos; I have a YouTube channel from back then with all the footage.

At that shop, we worked on a wide range of vehicles, from motorcycles and ATVs to dune buggies and electric scooters. That was my introduction to the industry. 

In 2018, when our lease was up and my mentor decided to retire, he handed the business and all its accounts to me and my business partner, who I met in the manosphere (shout out to Antigravity74).

After that, I began working for Bird Scooters, which was the biggest player in the micro-mobility sector at the time, valued at around $2 billion. I learned the ins and outs of the business while working there. Then, we took Pacific Rides and transformed it from a power sports business into a micro-mobility company.

Green Gorilla:

Oh, so it’s not actually a motorized bike company, but rather a micro-mobility company?

Ulysses Washington:

Yes, that’s what it is. When I say micro-mobility, I mean small electric mobility devices instead of larger vehicles like buggies or traditional machines. In this new era, when people say micro-mobility or when I say micro-mobility, it usually refers to e-bikes, e-scooters, electric skateboards, and what they call LSEVs (low-speed electric vehicles) such as micro cars or quadricycles. Essentially, anything with less than two kilowatts of power.

Green Gorilla:

Gotcha, gotcha. So, you were working for this larger company—what inspired you to start your own micro-mobility company? A lot of times, people feel safe where they are, making money and feeling secure. What made you decide to venture off on your own in this sector?

Ulysses Washington:

That’s a good question. The pandemic actually played a significant role in that decision. When the lockdown started, I wasn’t out in the streets working for Bird anymore. I was working from home during the pandemic, which gave me time to think and plan strategically. We made the right moves with our money and invested in our own software, developing our own products at that point. There was no guarantee I’d have a job with Bird once everything opened back up, so the pandemic was largely the driver behind my decision to start my own company.

Green Gorilla:

That’s awesome, man. Now, can you give me an overview of the types of micro-mobility vehicles that your company offers? I know you kind of mentioned it or alluded to it earlier. And what sets your machinery apart from your competitors?

Ulysses Washington:

Would you like me to show you some of the products, or would you prefer that I just describe them to you?

Green Gorilla:

Yeah, for the sake of our discussion now, let’s just talk about it.

Ulysses Washington:

Okay, so we have a shop in Northridge, California, called VME Bikes, where we build custom bikes. One side of our business is building bespoke bikes, where you tell us what you want, and we build it. The other side is the e-scooter segment and the traditional e-bike with hub motor styles. You can’t really beat China in terms of production when it comes to price points, so our best bet is to source the best products from there.

You can find cheaper products at Target, Walmart, or Amazon all day long, but I’ve tested and ridden so many different brands of scooters and bikes. I’ll dig into the components each vehicle has, look at the aesthetic appeal, and make my judgment based on those factors. 

I have a partner overseas in China, and we deal directly with the factories. It takes a lot of vetting because I’ve worked on many different vehicles during my time with Bird. Some scooters were light, easy to use, and quick, but they didn’t have a big battery. Others were big and bulky with big batteries, but many people couldn’t handle them. Then there are medium-range options, but they may have pros and cons as well. After working with various brands, I’ve learned what makes a good e-scooter or e-bike. As the industry matures, people are starting to come up with innovative and cool designs, and we try to offer the best quality products to our customers.

Green Gorilla:

Okay, so what would you say are some of the key benefits of using a motorized bike compared to a traditional bicycle or a motorcycle?

Ulysses Washington:

An e-bike serves as an in-between option when compared to a traditional bicycle or a motorcycle. If you don’t feel comfortable riding a regular bike for longer distances, like seven, eight, or ten miles, an e-bike makes it feel like you’re riding half the distance.

There’s also the energy cost factor. Charging an e-bike is more cost-effective compared to the expenses associated with driving a car, such as gas, maintenance, wear and tear, and insurance costs. We use spreadsheets and cost analysis to show the savings you can achieve by parking your car and using an e-bike to travel short distances, like riding three miles to the grocery store. Most people typically grab about two bags of groceries on average, so using an e-bike for these simple trips can save you money and provide convenience.

Green Gorilla:

Or to go back and get something that you just forgot. Or just to spend time away from the house, sometimes people go shopping because they don’t want to be in the house, you know.

Ulysses Washington:

Yeah man, using an e-bike or e-scooter offers convenience and versatility. You can throttle it if you don’t want to pedal, and the motor has power. It’s an in-between option compared to a traditional bike or car. E-bikes and e-scooters are convenient, small, and easily maneuverable. You can take them inside stores, track them with your phone, and more. It’s not about replacing your car entirely, but rather using e-bikes or e-scooters in conjunction with your car to be less reliant on it and make it more reliable.

In terms of climate change, using micro-mobility options like e-scooters and e-bikes for simple trips can make a significant dent in carbon emissions, instead of completely trying to wipe out an entire automotive sector. This is why I promote micro-mobility as a more practical solution to address environmental concerns without completely eliminating gas-powered cars.

Green Gorilla:

Gotcha. So this leads me to another question. Can you explain the various laws and regulations that pertain to motorized bikes, and how they might differ in different regions of the country or even within your own West Coast region?

Ulysses Washington:

Well, I’m going to tell you right now, it’s more of a, it’s more, I think this was at the onset. Remember when Obama was first elected, and there was that infrastructure bill that was passed, like the first one with a specific name?

Green Gorilla:

I can’t remember.

Ulysses Washington:

I can’t remember it either. But you still see the name on signs, or like on California highways sometimes, because the funding to do the road extensions and stuff came from that bill. So you see these boards still up on certain highways here in California. However, within that bill, part of it was essentially like, if money was going to be used to repave city roads and such, it had to be done with a bike lane when it was completed.

Green Gorilla:

Yeah, I remember now. Yes, it’s called the Clean Energy and Security Act.

Ulysses Washington:

There you go, that’s it right there. That was kind of the impetus that started all this. So in that bill, every time you go to repaint the streets or repave the roads and all that, guess what you’re going to add?

Green Gorilla:

I remember the bike lanes being added. In St. Louis, yeah.

Ulysses Washington:

Right, exactly. And so, anywhere there’s not a bike lane, just think of it like this: at some point, whenever they’re going to repave that road, they’re going to repave it with one. Gotcha? Okay. So, from an infrastructure standpoint, that was the start of it – adding a bike lane to traditional roads. And then, any new roads that are created, guess what they do? They already include a bike lane.

Green Gorilla:

Got it. Speaking of environmental responsibility, how do you approach sustainability and environmental responsibility with your business, particularly in terms of manufacturing and the use of materials? I mean, you talked about outsourcing manufacturing to an extent, but you do assembly here, right? I’m assuming?

Ulysses Washington:

Yeah, that would be the answer to that question – to do assembly here. Let’s look at this from a brief macroeconomics and global economics perspective. Because of things like inflation, cost of importation, and tariffs on certain things coming from overseas, like Asia and China, over the last two years, the cost to actually get things from China has gone up. Right? You know what I mean? So, this is just kind of matter of fact.

Sometimes you’ll look at the cost of getting something from China, and you’d be like, “Why am I paying this much for Chinese products?” Because we’ve always associated Chinese products with something cheap.

Green Gorilla:

Yeah, yeah, that’s true.

Ulysses Washington:

But what’s happened here is that China has really upped the ante in terms of their own manufacturing practices. They have factories that crank out Grade B and Grade C products with Grade B and Grade C batteries, but that’s not what I deal with. When you deal with the higher-end stuff, they have competitive price points. So much so that if you were to start building motors here in the US, and then building the batteries, controllers, chassis, and dashes, you would not be able to match them.

Green Gorilla:

Gotcha. Yeah, you wouldn’t be able to compete.

Ulysses: Washington

Right, so the strategy here is to source components from China. But then you start to build, like, say, your chassis, for example, right, you could do that. And then use batteries, motors, wheels, brake components, cables – you can get all that at a really cheap price and then incorporate it. So now you’re bringing the cost of production down. On our e-bike builds, we use Bafang mid-drive motor kits, which are produced in Taiwan. They’re essentially some of the best mid-drive motor kits you can get for the price point, super reliable and durable. We’ll incorporate those but then use frames from various other sources, and all the other components are bespoke European components, with all types of high-quality features. But when we’re talking about the Chinese stuff, we’re talking about the general consumer.

Green Gorilla:

Gotcha. This leads me to the next question, which is, what is your target market and consumer demographic? And also, have you seen any interesting trends in terms of who is actually purchasing motorized bikes?

Ulysses Washington:

Yeah, it’s largely… you know, it’s funny, there’s sort of a gap in the market. You have the boomer market. A lot of the boomer demographic want a new bike. A perfect example: in Sonoma County, this was in 2021, they had a program where they had 1,000 vouchers. People could apply for the voucher or whatever, it was first come, first served. The majority of the people that got this voucher to purchase a new e-bike were people over 50. That was the majority of the people that utilized that voucher program to purchase an e-bike.

Green Gorilla:

I wouldn’t have suspected that, especially people over 50.

Ulysses Washington:

Well, because what it is, is remember, we were talking about distance riding with e-bikes. It’s not a stress on older people to ride a long distance on an e-bike. They still get a workout, but they can go further. Older demographic people look at it as a leisure vehicle – they get exercise, hubby and wife can get on the bike one morning and go ride five miles to their favorite breakfast spot, park the bike, don’t have to worry about charging it, and it’s got plenty of juice to get back. And then they may take the long way back. So there’s that demographic. The Gen X market, that’s where it kind of jumps. There’s not a lot of Gen X that’s into this stuff. They’re slow to it. I’m Gen X, but I’m all into this. Most of Gen X, though, they’re kind of not there with it. And then you get to Millennials and Gen Z, and boom, they’re into it.

Green Gorilla:

Yeah, I guess it might be because of upbringing and what we consider a display of wealth or accumulation.

Ulysses Washington:

Honestly, I think Gen X would be the only generation that looks at it as corny. They kind of see it as a novelty. Whereas everybody else, once they try it, they see the practicality in it.

Green Gorilla:

I can see the practicality in it right now. I use a traditional bike to go two or three miles down the road to buy groceries or something. But I can see going even further than what I do now if I had the additional electric support.

Ulysses Washington:

Yeah, and the thing about an electric bike too is, let’s say the battery goes dead. On my bike, if the battery goes dead, you’re just riding a regular bike.

Green Gorilla:

Gotcha. Yeah, you’re just…

Ulysses Washington:

Gonna pedal it and you don’t feel any resistance or drag from it. Right. So you’re just riding a regular bike.

Green Gorilla:

Gotcha. But this leads me to another question as well. Yeah, we talked about like, what generations? See it as, you know, the wave of the future what generation sees it as a novelty and the reasons for why they see it in that way. But what do you see? Uh, where do you see the motorized bike industry going in the future? In the next five to 10 years?

Ulysses Washington:

Okay, so I’m, I’m trying to remember his name. I’ll have to email it to you. I’ll dig it up and email it to you. I think his last name is, I think his name is David Stubblefield. David, David Stubblefield. I’m gonna I’ll dig it up and send it to you. I want to say his name is David Stubblefield. But this is a guy who did a talk. This was maybe right before the onset of the pandemic, maybe like around January-February 2020, at the Harvard School of Business, okay. And he was talking about the micro-mobility industry, and essentially he prefaced his lecture there by saying that the micro-mobility companies of today are the car companies of tomorrow. Gotcha. Right. So when we look at where this all goes, this is when you were asking me sort of like, well, you know, what interests do you have? And, you know, and I was telling you, okay, look, we do e-scooters, we do e-bikes, we do all the IoT, the app stuff, right for ride-share, for delivery, and all that. So we have the software that connects to all this stuff and everything. And then from there, you can take verticals upward into small cars, you know, stuff like that. Right? Quadricycles, e-bikes that have like trailers on them. You know, there’s a lot of different verticals, heck, you can go into robots too. It’s real easy to put robots onto the software stack that we’re using; it works the same way. Right.

Chase Stubblefield-The Case For Micromobility

Green Gorilla:

You know what, this is just a suggestion. I know, I’m interviewing you. But this is just a suggestion, I had to think about this. Have you thought about like, taking some of the ability to use the motorized components of your, you know, your micro-mobility business and using it in order to help the entertainment business like dollies, camera dollies and things of this nature? 

Ulysses Washington:

I wanted to, you know, like so for example, um, you know, they use the golf carts around the studio lots. Yeah, I wanted to replace those with scooters. Yeah, that, that right there. You know what you can, I’ve seen dude, I’ve so what I’ve seen is I’ve seen like, what they call like a general use bot. And this is guy who made one on YouTube. And you could kind of you make like a base bot. And then you can kind of configure it to do different things. So for example, like you were saying, like moving around equipment on a lot studio set, stuff like that, you know, there’s, there’s, there’s all these different business verticals, bro. And like, that’s a brilliant idea. Because the only idea that I had, and this was somebody that wanted to do this with me, they brought it to me, like a few years ago, this is pre-pandemic, but they were like, Yeah, you know, I want to just rent scooters to the studio lots, so they can park the golf, those old, decrepit golf carts. I was like, Damn, that’s a good idea, man. That’s a really good idea. You know?

Green Gorilla:

And another thing that I thought like, you know, it was I know, I’m interviewing you. But I also thought like, Okay, what if you could partner with like, local businesses, but typically, those businesses where there’s a lot of people who come for, you know, recreational events, like public parks, like zoos, or, you know, 

Ulysses Washington:

Like a fair, like a, like a county fair, or something that comes to the city or whatever.

Green Gorilla:

Yeah, or amusement parks or something like that, you know, but, you know, I don’t know how difficult it would be to secure a contract with companies like that, because a lot of times they want to, you know, take things in house and generate profit for themselves.

Ulysses Washington:

Man, it’s your money right now, when it comes to that. And that’s a brilliant idea. I’m glad you brought that up. Right. Because I think what has to be spoken to is the verticals. Right? So you might think that the idea might be crazy, and I’m in my head, I’m like, no, actually. No. Because that’s a completely separate business that they then have to have they have to. So they have to have, like, human resource capital, well, then they have to have the actual capital itself to sort of fund a new segment of business to do all this. And they would prefer not to, typically, if you have everything together, right? Yeah, there you go. That and so now what we’re doing is we’re talking B2B (business to business) , right? So and what it is, it’s a pitch. It’s a value-add pitch. See? So it was you’re talking about the, so let’s say you hit me up and you’re just like, you’re complex, man. Like, I had this idea. And you just ran it down to me just like you ran it down. And I’m like, word. Okay, so what, is there something going on in your area? And you’re like, yeah, man, actually, I was thinking about it. Because there’s such and such and such and so is going on, right? And then you go and find the promoter, or the person responsible, the people responsible for putting it on? And then it’s a phone call on my end. Gotcha, gotcha. Okay. And then that’s what we’re doing. We’re doing a pitch to do B2B. And so that’s how, you know, that’s how those things are secured. You know, it is looking at, like use cases, right, man, you know, we could do this with this. Yeah, you know, that’s a good idea, man, let’s give them a ring. Let’s see, you know, see what they say. Because a lot of you know, I would say right now that that’s how it works with, you know, myself and all my partners, it just like how would you say, No, it is crazy, bro.

Green Gorilla:

You, I get it, man, you know?

Ulysses Washington:

Right. It’s crazy. So,

Green Gorilla:

So peep this, you talked a little bit about the process of design and engineering, your bikes, and the various, you know, sources from which you draw components and, you know, different, you know, parts and pieces in order to build a whole micro-mobility product. Okay. But, uh, you kind of talked to me before we began this interview about some partnerships that you may have had with other companies. Would you like to mention those now?

Ulysses Washington:

Okay. All right. Well, my company, Pacific Rides, is a partnership between myself and Antigravity74. He’s been floating around the manosphere for years. We linked up and became business partners in 2017. Along with that, we have BME Bikes. You know, like BMX bikes? Yes, sir. We do BME Bikes, which are designed for rough, rugged use. That’s the big-boy stuff right there. Those are the bikes we were talking about on one of your live streams, where I mentioned some that go for 10k and up. Our custom-built bikes typically start around the 1800 to 2000 range and then basically go up from there. We also have HX E-Scooters and Manual E-Scooters, two companies that I import from overseas, but the warehouses are here in the States. So, all the products are local, and I get my hands on everything to verify it. It’s not stuff that gets shipped over to the customer from overseas; it’s already here. Another important thing is supply chain management – ensuring that you have a direct connection with the manufacturer so that you always have an accurate supply count. And you always want to try to be as close to your supply source as possible. I can always just hop in the truck and head down, an hour and a half or an hour and 45 minutes, to get to the warehouses and get an eyeball count.

Green Gorilla:

So, we’re kind of winding it down now. Six more questions. What are some of the most common misconceptions or myths about motorized bikes that you’d like to debunk?

Ulysses Washington:

All right. One misconception is that electric bikes don’t operate like regular bikes. They do; they’re called pedal-assist bikes. You still have to pedal an e-bike like a regular bike, but you have the option to use the thumb throttle for extra power. When you’re pedaling, it feels like riding a regular bike in terms of tension and what your body feels. The difference is the bike adds electricity based on your pedaling – that’s why it’s called pedal-assist. So that’s the first misconception: that an e-bike is just like an electric motorcycle. It’s not. When you have a mid-drive electric bike, with the motor on the front gear, it’s almost like having an electric motorcycle with gears, but you’re still pedaling. It’s a different ride experience, and people usually realize the difference once they try it.

Green Gorilla:

You know, I’ve got to get my hands on one.

Ulysses Washington:

Yeah, you’ve got to try one. If you can find a shop in your area, go down and try a bike. I’d suggest trying both a hub motorbike and a mid-drive bike. You’ll probably love the mid-drive bike more, even though they’re pricier, but you need to feel it for yourself. So that’s the first misconception. The second misconception is that all products from China are cheap and of low quality. That’s not true. It’s the same with anything, even in the States – the quality depends on where you buy from. The third misconception is that we, as Black men, don’t have a place in this industry.

Green Gorilla:

Gotcha. Okay, that’s…

Ulysses Washington:

The third misconception. That’s a total myth.

Green Gorilla:

So this leads me to ask the question: What’s the most challenging aspect of running a motorized bike business?

Ulysses Washington:

We’re still in the early adopter phase, a bit ahead of the opportunity curve, which has its pros and cons. You never want to be tardy to the party, right? So we want to be ahead of the opportunity curve, but the slow adoption is challenging. It’s like when people say, “If I would have just invested $10,000 in Amazon back in 1997.” You hear that quite often. So, do you want to be saying that again in another 30 years, but just about micro-mobility? If not, then we may want to look at this as a viable sector of technology and even automotive in terms of mobility. We don’t have any large car companies that were primary owners of this sector. So, this is an opportunity to plant our flag in the transportation sector when it comes to vehicles, manufacturing, and so on. I see it from a few angles, to be honest with you.

Green Gorilla:

So, I’m going to ask you just two more questions. They’re kind of long, but you’ve got time?

Ulysses Washington:

Man, I’ve got time, bro. We’re good.

Green Gorilla:

Do you have any memories or inspiring stories of customers who’ve had positive experiences with your motorized bikes?

Ulysses Washington:

Man, just recently. So, I supplied this guy with a scooter, one of the ones I was telling you about. It’s designed by Porsche, and he bought it as a Christmas present to himself. He was looking at the cost analysis and all that. He works at the local grocery store that I go to. My daughter and I, when the weather’s good, hop on our scooters and do the two-mile ride down there, grab our stuff, and ride two miles back. One day he sees us and asks where we got the scooters. I gave him a card and told him that’s what we do. He said he needed something to get to work because he was taking Uber every day. Check this out: he was paying $400 a month to get to work, but he only lived four miles away. I couldn’t believe he was paying $400 a month to Uber for just four miles one way and four miles back – eight miles a day, five days a week.

Green Gorilla:

Yeah, that’s crazy. So…

Ulysses Washington:

Here’s what I did. I got him a scooter for like 400 bucks. Let’s think about this for a second, right? So now he gets the scooter, and I said, “Well, look, here’s what you do, man. If you put it on full speed, you get an honest eight miles. You’re only four miles away. So when you go to work, take your charger with you. Go to work, put the scooter away, plug it up. When you’re done, it’s fully charged, and you’re good to go on the way back home. Wash, rinse, repeat.” Bro, he’s been singing the praises ever since, like, “Man, I saved so much money.”

Green Gorilla:

I know he’s happy.

Ulysses Washington:

So, that’s the most recent use case I can tell you, man.

Green Gorilla:

That’s dope, man. That’s a good one. So, I think we’ve already kind of covered it: How do you stay up to date with industry trends and technological advancements in your field?

Ulysses Washington:

Well, just one quick answer to that, if you don’t mind me mentioning. On the Black Brain Trust channel, we cover a lot of the trends. We actually do live streams and stuff where we dig into it, analyze stuff, and all that. Actively talking about it with other people, putting the news out there, getting feedback – that gives me real-time data. So, I would say that’s one of the things, being actively engaged so that you can always be a subject matter expert in it because you’re always following up on it and doing it yourself. Then, you can always tell people the right information based on what you’ve synthesized.

Green Gorilla:

Last question, What advice would you give to somebody who’s actually interested in starting a business in motorized biking?

Ulysses Washington:

Now’s a better time as any because if you wanted to start your own car company, it takes a lot of money. But with Micromobility, if you have the right business model, market, and you know what you’re gonna do, you have to really vet it. So, you got to talk to people that are in the industry. That’s why we try to do live streams and make ourselves available. You got to seek out solid sources of information about the industry. It’s more beneficial to smaller companies than the big boys. The guys that had all the money early on, but then, because of all the belt tightening, due to legislation, lawsuits, and other issues, it’s more challenging for them. So, it’s about utilizing that capital, maximizing on it, and doing your intel. This can be an expensive venture or, if you do it right, a profitable one.

Green Gorilla:

Gotcha. That’s a lot to consider, man, and a lot to chew on. But I appreciate you doing the interview.

Ulysses Washington:

I appreciate you for having me, man. I love talking about this stuff. There are other brothers getting into it, and we need to get eyes on it. This is the next wave, and I see brothers jumping on board, but we need to get more attention on it.

Green Gorilla:

I hear you, man. Well, I’m putting some eyes on it. I appreciate you, bro. Much love.